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Stimpy
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Driver



Joined: Sep 25, 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:12 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'm trying to find this article I read at a doctors office a couple seasons ago. Maybe you've heard something of this:

The artical was in a popular magazine, maybe popular science or one of the automotive ones. It featured this device that fits into the fuel system near the injectors. It was about the size of a shoe box. The article explained that the box used electricity to boost the octane of the gas effectively to about 127 from 89. I think it somehow converted it to hydrogen but I might be remembering the article wrong. I do know that the vehicle had to be modified to take the higher octane and also to support the higher draw on the alternator. The people who produced it say that the unit requires about a thousand dollars worth of parts to make and it's still being developed, but it would probably be ready for production in a few years.

Here's a similar article, not the one I originaly read but it sounds about the same:

If you aren't yet ready to give up your SUV but feel a pang of guilt every time you pass a Prius, then a new technology under development in Canada could soon soothe your conscience by providing a bridge between the internal combustion engine of today and the clean-energy world of tomorrow. The H2N-Gen, from Innovative Hydrogen Solutions, Inc., in Winnipeg, Manitoba, will be an after-market add-on the size of a cable box. Its inventor, Joe Williams, Sr., claims that it can cut fuel consumption by up to 40 percent and reduce emissions by at least 50 percent.

The device creates hydrogen through electrolysis by running a current from the vehicle's battery through a small reservoir of potassium hydroxide solution. The resulting hydrogen is pumped into the engine's intake manifold. Williams says that because hydrogen is much more flammable than gasoline, the spark plug ignites fuel at the top of the combustion chamber rather than in the middle, thereby causing the fuel to burn at a higher efficiency.

As for safety, Williams maintains that the H2N-Gen creates hydrogen at pressures below the explosion threshold, but just in case, the device is contained inside a plastic bladder capable of absorbing 6,000 pounds of pressure. Models designed for heavy-goods vehicles, stationary generators and SUVs should hit the U.S. market in March. The SUV version will cost about $1,000.


Anyways... Mr. Wizard, what are your thoughts on this? (don't worry, I promise not to blow myself up building a hydrogen generator in my garage)
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Misha
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Joined: Aug 02, 2006
Posts: 705
Location: McLean, VA, USA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:53 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The short answer from “Mr. Wizard” would be “crap and crap”.

It’s kind of hard to give an extended answer based on info that some random reporter of unknown qualifications put together. A few points could be made, though.

1. When someone claims immediate improvements from bolt-ons in a range higher than single percentage digits, my experience tells me this is crap.

2. I don’t see any point in having 127 octane in a regular engine, it does not do you any good – see this section in myths.

3. Hydrogen is not news to the industry. I remember my peer working on it back in 80’s, and I know many automakers and researchers do work on it, still. It promises a lot in terms of ecology and sustainability. But acceptable solution obviously is not here yet. And nobody among serious players considers on-board hydrogen production, because it will constitute “perpetuum mobile” or a break of fundamental laws of physics.

4. Words about combustion and ignition are a complete nonsense, if you give it a minimal thought. Did you ever see a piece of paper starting to burn from one end while you are trying to ignite it from another? Me neither, and this is essentially what this guy is trying to tell us…
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Stimpy
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Joined: Sep 25, 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:18 am Reply with quote Back to top

I had heard that producing hydrogen requires more energy than you'd get out of it. I wasn't sure if that was just refering to the breaking down of water.

This sounded a bit different... producing hydrogen from the fuel already there.

too bad it isn't magic though Wink
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Misha
Site Owner



Joined: Aug 02, 2006
Posts: 705
Location: McLean, VA, USA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 6:30 pm Reply with quote Back to top

It's still the same s*** another day... Very Happy sorry Wink
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Stimpy
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Joined: Sep 25, 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:53 am Reply with quote Back to top

here's the article in How Stuff Works

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/how-a-hydrogen-boosted-gasoline-engine-works.htm


now my gass mizer civic project has wings again! ...I just need a hydrogen converter and an automotive engineer...

it sounds like you could recreate the prototype with minimal mods to a car. maybe just increasing the compression, adding the hydrogen thing, and fooling with the computer
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Misha
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Joined: Aug 02, 2006
Posts: 705
Location: McLean, VA, USA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 1:24 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Hmm, looks like I'll have to read through this to be able to tell you something meaningfull. Based on the statements they have on the first page - somebody does not know what he is talking about, but I'll read the whole article and get back to you on this a couple of days later, ok?
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Misha
Site Owner



Joined: Aug 02, 2006
Posts: 705
Location: McLean, VA, USA

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:57 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Since article is not really clear on what that stuff is and what it does, I spent some time on Arvin Meritor site, trying to clarify the picture.

Just a few observations from there - mentioned technology itself is intended for diesel engines' emissions control system, and marketed as such. Any references to gasoline engines are very vague and are dated back to 2004, and nothing since. Based on available info, I would say this technology is not ready yet, and it is even not clear if it ever would...
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Stimpy
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Joined: Sep 25, 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:03 pm Reply with quote Back to top

guess I'll just keep waiting for that muffler that turns the exhaust into a scramjet Very Happy
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garryj
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Joined: Sep 01, 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 1:09 am Reply with quote Back to top

Hi everyone, I hve also heard about the device which can attach with your vehicle's engine & instead of gas or petrol it use water for running your vehicle. It simply convert your vehicle into a water-burning hybrid.

Link snipped.
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Misha
Site Owner



Joined: Aug 02, 2006
Posts: 705
Location: McLean, VA, USA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 8:51 am Reply with quote Back to top

Hi garryj and welcome to Fun and Safe Driving!

It was not a good idea to start with posting a link, so I removed it. In fact, it was not a good idea to promote this water4gas scam either.
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arun
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Joined: Dec 25, 2009
Posts: 100

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:49 am Reply with quote Back to top

I couldnt understand your post fully. May be thats a new technology but make sure its road tested. Safety is first.
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